What's it really like to be an actor today?

This week, we speak to David McCulloch about the realities of being an actor. From writing your own material to sending off audition tapes, David gives his advice on how to deal with rejection, whether you need an agent, and much more

Participants

• Emily Slade - podcast producer and host, Prospects
• David McCulloch - actor

Transcript

Emily Slade: Hello and welcome back to Future You, the podcast brought to you by graduate careers experts Prospects. I'm your host, Emily Slade and in this episode I speak to David about being an actor.

David McCulloch: Hello, my name is David McCullough. I'm a serious actor. 

Emily Slade: Amazing. So what does a serious actor mean? 

David McCulloch: I mean, I wouldn't say I'm that serious. So I'm a professional actor and every time I say that I cringe a little inside because I always find it weird calling myself an actor. Especially because won't be the case with you, because we know each other. But if you introduce yourself as an actor to a stranger, you get an array of questions and judgement and all other negative things that you don't want being thrown at you. Mostly a judgement of why an actor and stuff like oh, really. But I've seen you in anything. Have you got anything lined up? How did you learn all those lines? I'm like, oh, I don't. It's more to it. But. Well, not so much on learning lines, but there is. But there's more to it than just because I've not been on Coronation Street. It doesn't mean I'm not an actor.

Emily Slade: Amazing. You've gone straight in there with a lot of the like myth busting. So you are a professional actor, that means essentially, I suppose that you get paid acting work more often than not. 

David McCulloch: Uh. More often than not, yes, but not more often than. 

Emily Slade: To be full time?

David McCulloch: Sort of, yes. Depends on the job I have, but yes, I do for some obscene reason, get paid to act, which is a very off always a pinch me moment for me whenever that happens and I see the money. Into my bank account. That goodness. That's great. So. 

Emily Slade: What's your educational journey up to this point?

David McCulloch: It was very much a pipe dream growing up. I always loved acting. I loved being on stage doing. Drama, not just as a mandatory subject at university. I remember at college there was the option to do like the full time BTEC which counted for 3 A levels. And my parents were like. Maybe don't put all your eggs in one basket. Maybe do something else and I was like, OK, well, I'll do one that counts as 1 A level and I'll do film studies. What else? Photography. Please choose English Lit as well. Okay, i'll choose English Lit. There. We go and then went to uni. I studied drama and media studies two Mickey Mouse for the price of one is the joke I always get (and I tend to make myself.) Self deprecating. That's what being an actor is. You said to Jim the camera.

Emily Slade: I did.

David McCulloch: So I yeah I I studied Drama and Media. And so what a lot of people would think that the next step would be is to go to drama school. But my parents had saved and very kindly paid for my university fees, which was back in the day when it was only three grand a year. I know I'm odd, it would have been a bit cheeky of me to be like hey, mum and Dad, thanks for money to let me have a higher education. Now, how about three times that much to do what you would essentially consider the same thing, but all the way up in in London. So after Uni, I wanted to keep the the, Craig's. Flame going, so I've joined a lot like Andrian go. But always kind of felt that to be a professional was just slightly out of reach. I didn't think there was any way to get into that, unless you've been to drama school and then it turns out that's not the case because I got involved with an amateur dramatics group in Winchester and I wanted to get more involved in like marketing. As well as acting because I thought, well, if I can't act all market because I like that kind of promotional aspect. And I was in rehearsals for one of the shows, and one of the women that was in it approached me and said that her and her mum had a professional theatre company and they were holding auditions. Did I want to go along? Said I was only a little bit of money, but all I heard was. Money. Yes. But I then immediately got imposter syndrome. "You're not actually a professional actor. Don't tell her. Don't tell her that you're not." And so I went along, auditioned, got in and then that's kind of how I got my foot in the door, I guess.

Emily Slade: Yeah. Amazing so. This is the thing. Let's talk about. There must be a variety of routes into the profession, as it were. So a lot of people assume you have to go to drama school. You don't. What are the perks are going to drama school?

David McCulloch: I don't know. My wife went to drama school and in her audition she was asked to do speech again, but as a pineapple.

Emily Slade: Full disclosure.

David McCulloch: You went to drama school?

Emily Slade: I went to drama school. I did do the audition rounds and I was asked to be a tea bag and then a used tea bag, So, what do you get? It's a much more. Intense training, you get showcases which are to be put in front of agents, so the next step would be in theory a lot of people might assume you'll need an agent in order to get you work in the industry. Do you have an agent? 

David McCulloch: No, I don't.

Emily Slade: Do you still get work in the industry?

David McCulloch: Yes. Perseverance. Applying for jobs constantly, but it's also a case of who you know. I have gotten jobs because I've worked with people and we've gotten unwell and then down the line they've gone. Hey. You weren't that and stuff. We've all you wanna come and do this job or something. I I do find with. Age. It depends on what kind of level you are. I think there are certain jobs in the industry that you can't get without an agent, but to get one of those, we big agents is very difficult. But then there are a lot of other agents that are kind of on the same level that maybe I'm at already or the other professionals are and they'll just be getting the work that I could get myself. And so I always think. Strive for an agent because you might need them for some of the more big and complicated jobs. If I ever get them, which is that the dream here's hoping it might be helpful as well to kind of get that knowledge from the agent side of things, because as an actor. Contracts and terms and conditions and usage and all that. Just straight over my head pretty much is quite lucky that my wife that I mentioned used to work in agency. So if I have any problems I usually go to her. Yeah, so it helps with the sort of nitty gritty admin side of things.

Emily Slade: But you would also then have to give a cut to your agent.

David McCulloch: Yes.

Emily Slade: So by sourcing work yourself, it means you save that money. 

David McCulloch: Yes. Most agents out there do say that if you source the work yourself then you don't have to pay them a Commission unless you choose to get them involved. I did have an issue with a past agent because I have had a couple of agents. 4 where I said, oh, I've gotten this job myself. I did it last year. I'm coming. It was like a seasonal gig, and I'm doing it again. But here's all my variability, and here's one. Anything else, but it was around the vested period where, unless you're already down for panto or something else, you probably won't be put down for much. And then she was like, I think you should put this contract through me. Otherwise you should think about looking for other representation. And I went OK, well, here's what your contract says and yeah. For representation, there is sadly in this industry, there are occasions where people will try and take the MIC a bit. There are there's a lot of stories of actors. Getting taken advantage of so one of the things and you do need, I'm sure this will be one of your questions. You do need a a lot of, I don't know, a strong will and backbone and option to be in this institute you have to deal with a lot of. Terrible people and rejection and stuff like that. And so it's just all about knowing your worth. That's the best advice I give to any actually just know what you're worth. 

Emily Slade: That's a nice that's some really nice way to put it. So you really do have to have like rock solid self esteem because. 10 times out of 10 it's not you. You didn't get this role because they hate you. You didn't get this role for a million reasons that had nothing to do with you. I still think. Amazing. So while we're on the thing of advice like. How do you deal with rejection? 

David McCulloch: Ohh, self pity and alcohol. I'm joking. I'm joking. This is a professional podcast. I don't know really. If it's something like a self tape, I can kind of send it off out of sight, out of mind. But whereas for me I I'm like a lot of actors, I don't live in London. I live in Hampshire and so sometimes I have to travel all the way up to London for an audition and it does. It is a little bit harder on the old. Confidence when you've. Woken up early. Pays money for train ticket. You travel all the way up to London. You get there really early because you don't trust train times and it takes like maybe. An hour 2 hours to get from your, maybe longer to get from your doorstep to London, and then you travel further into deepest, darkest steps and you get there. Take you forever. You're sweating your heart or your freezing cold or whatever the weather's like and you get in 5 minutes later. If that. Thanks very much off you go. So even that in itself is a bit like. Oh. God. So sometimes that kind of softens the rejection blow a bit, but then you think. Why did I go all the way up there? Why did I bother? So it's trying to push through.

Emily Slade: Why do you bother?

David McCulloch: Mostly because I wanted the job. 

Emily Slade: So it is always worth it. It's it's hard work is the is what I'm getting. It's hard work, but you get paid to do what you love.

David McCulloch: Yes. And that is a privilege that I'm very, very glad to have them. I can get paid for, for doing what I like. I have gotten some. Acting job. Yeah. And so then? 

Emily Slade: What do they tend to look like? Like? You're not on Corrie. You're not in Guardians of the Galaxy 3. Or are you? So like what? What are you as a consistently jobbing actor, which is like, believe what you're referred to as? Are what does that? What does the work look? 

David McCulloch: Like so, before I became professional, I just shoot that a professional actor or someone that went up to London and filmed on a big TV show or a film or had, like, a long run in the West End or something like that. Uh, but then when I actually did it, first acting job by Deborah on five days in total still got paid for just great. And then the second one that I had, I did it alongside my then full time job because I used to work in an office and it was touring to like regional areas, like taking theatre to community centres. Local theatres, village halls, churches, hovercraft. Not one that was moving, but in the Hovercraft Museum. Completely like this was so different to what I thought acting was going to be, but it felt the tour that I'm talking about was the way the production company local to me called Black Box Theatre and we drove around. We put up the stage and the set and lights and all that ourselves. So it's very collaborative. Effort. And I was like, oh, this is a different side that you don't really see if you're a normal person who just thinks acting is being Benedict Cumberbatch. And then there's loads of other jobs that I had that fall under acting that you don't really think. Ohh yeah, that counts as an acting job. Like immersive theatre stuff or role play work. I do a lot of that. I've managed to get in with quite. A few companies so like what's just going to? That what's wrong? They work. So it depends on what company you're doing, but basically. Companies will use actors for simulations to help train people for other jobs. So like medical world plays, an easy one to explain where they'll be training, you know, upcoming doctors and nurses. Is and they'll have actors. They'll be given a sheet with. This is your character. This is your ailman. Off you go acquires a lot of improv and thinking on your feet. You've gotta react to the person talking to you and also quite a lot of pressure because it's like, wow, this person's trained to be a doctor or nurse. A real job and I'm here. Helping them do that. And I've done a lot of like. Hostile environment training role play. Where they're people that would be trained up to go to, you know, first world countries or war-torn countries and they'll have actors playing civilians, sometimes progressive simulations and stuff like that because you're training people for but wide range of scenarios that they could go into. Especially given the state of the world at the moment, but we're they're training people to go into these places and provide aid and fight support to people who have been potentially victims of warfare and they could be doing a lot of. Conflict out there. So that's some of the scenarios that we do, which is quite which is a lot of fun for us because you know, but it's very playing around. We're just playing around, is playing around waving guns about. It's grateful you're not training to be a doctor. No, they're not. So that's things I didn't think of before. And that's a lot of fun to do, and it keeps the creative muscles going cause a lot of improv involved, and you've got to stay in character because you gotta keep the. The simulation as real as possible, because these are people have paid a lot of money for these courses to go into real world scenarios. You don't want to mess that up. 

Emily Slade: Mm-hmm. You talked about keeping the muscles active. Is that something that you have to be aware of? What are the? What are the sort of costs of being an actor when you think about things like? Sure, girls. Headshots, workshops, keeping, keeping you active when you're not getting paid work. 

David McCulloch: Well, great thing is with stuff like. Role play work. It's a lot more consistent than your plays, your films and all of that. And I got into that because I knew people that had already worked in it. That quite a few friends in the industry that makes me sound really important, you know, Martin Freeman got his speed dial. He told me to look at the camera. No, because a lot of friends do it. And you know what you doing this and that. Ohh, come along to this or that very much like a lot of these company. Just because they are not created companies per se, they're always on lookout for actors. So it is a case of who you know for those kind of gigs. If you've gone a long time between doing, say, like a play, you can be a little bit rusty and I do find that I always find the first day of rehearsing something. I'm like, we have to get up and do it. The worst feeling ever. I don't know what I'm doing, so I'm tired. I don't want to. Can I just go home because you're not done it in a while. It's like with anything. It's like if you have when the bike for ages, you get on it again. But so. In terms of like the. Physical mental side of it it. Is good to keep. Those creative juices going in in a. Way and you. 

Emily Slade: Can you do that for free in your own time by just like learning a monologue off your own basket? Yeah, just practising with friends, that kind of thing. 

David McCulloch:Yeah, I know some people that definitely do that.

Emily Slade: Yeah. But like can you? Pay for like. Work trips and courses to keep you ticking over?

David McCulloch: I think there are definitely like actors workshops out there, and I know a few people that have done them and said they're really beneficial and I know a few people that have got on like acting retreat. If you cost a fair bit of money, which I don't currently have. You kind of know you're. Getting something for for that because they're offering quite a unique experience that you would get anywhere else in terms of going back to your question about costs, headshots and show reels and stuff like that. It is very costly. This industry, and sometimes it just kind of makes you go, ah, in order to get acting work, I'd spent a lot of money to get things I need to get the acting work and stuff like that.

Emily Slade: Unlike an agent, are there things that you absolutely do need?

David McCulloch:You absolutely need a headshot. 

Emily Slade: Which is a picture of your face.

David McCulloch: Yes, but one that kind of a professional looking one I. When I first got my headshots like my first ever ones. I had no idea. I had no a little to do so I kind of like what's an actors look like. That or smile, whatever. So you've got to think about what characters you want to play. And have different looks and styles for. If you don't live in London, it can be quite tricky to find a headshot photographer, cause they're all in London, but look around locally and might find there a little bit cheap for the ones in London I the last set of headshots I had was from a local photographer called Mike Bell and they're fantastic. Even better so. Show real basically what you need is or. What you should aim to get is a. Video montage of your acting work. You can get, you can pay for a show or scene where they will have written up like 1-2 or three. Different types of scenes and they will be professionally shot and edited, and then you've got video evidence of you being able to act and then you can basically show, oh, it's in the name, a show reel. You can show a reel of your work, but they are very expensive. If you don't have a lot of. Money to get a show we've seen. And then looking out for like student productions is quite handy, it can be a bit of a lottery and they don't always pay, but some just pay like expenses and stuff. And you get a free shirt off sticking out of it. And you know, that's how I started for that. The odd short film I've done here and there. I'm always thinking it's a bit of a scene that I can just take some of that and use it. I'm quite lucky that I have a basic understanding of video editing software, but you can stitch clips together in imovie. But it is quite there is is almost like a lot. You need to have like. The best headshots and the best show realise people say. If when you're starting out, just getting a couple of pictures of your face against a blank background and even just filming yourself doing a monologue just so you've got something to start with so someone can see what you're like. Like I know people who have been doing this for years and they've done good work, but they don't have a show reel because they've just somehow managed to build the contacts as they go and. Yeah. The other thing about cost and this is one thing I hate about this industry is that acting seems to be the only industry where you have to pay to apply for jobs. So you don't have to on indeed or total jobs are real. But on stuff like Spotlight and Mandy, you have to pay to create. We'd have paid to credit profile on something like Mandy, but you have to pay to apply for paid jobs, right? And it's also quite tricky getting on spotlight because you have to. I think you've had a certain number of credits and your name already to be accepted onto that and you're paid privilege for applying for work, and then you can't even see all the acting jobs because only if you're not represented by an agent, you can cease amounts. If you have an agent, they get see more. That's quite tricky. 

Emily Slade: Do you have to have? A job that's not acting on the side. 

David McCulloch: Yes, definitely. Unless you are super, super lucky. Yeah, it's good to have a side hustle. Some people just do acting as like, a part time thing and that's absolutely. Fine, some people to do it a lot more full time. I'd love for this to be my full time profession, but I've been doing this for coming up to 8 years professionally and I am a realist that. You do need. Another job to help pay the bills, as it were. When I started, I was doing a full time like. 37 to 40 hour job I was working in the public sector, but I was very lucky that my boss at the time used to be in a band, so he had that kind of creative. Love inside him. So he let me utilise, probably abuse the chance that I could work flexibly and I was able to acting alongside it, but then it got to a point where I had a very lucky year in 2021 where I had quite a few jobs lined up and I'd used up all my annual leave and I didn't have any flexi time left. And my new boss had said Ohh you can't do what you've been doing and be flexible with your hours so it's like. OK, then I'm gonna make a decision. And that decision was to hand in my notice and make a go of it properly. And I was very lucky in the 2021 while I went from doing a play, doing another play, doing a music video, a short play and then a big seasonal contract and January hit and I had nothing. All this money's gonna go. So it is good to have a side hustle. I used to be a Deliveroo rider. So 0 hours is great. I know a lot of people. When it was first introduced like Ohh 0 hours, it's not great. And there was a risk cause you're not guaranteed shift so. Make self invaluable in that job, but not too invaluable. Then they won't be annoyed when you leave if you leave. So I'm very lucky. There's a theatre local to me with the 0 hours which I've cut, you know 0 hours contract which is guest experience. So it's working the bar ushering, scanning, working the cafe because it's a theatre. They know that I'm an actor and I do it professionally, so that very supportive of that, and they understand that. I like that they're outside of it. I like getting a lot of shifts, but I also have the flexibility. 

Emily Slade: Even if you were to get, let's say, a feature film, do you think you would be that side hustle because there's no guarantee, you know, just again just trying to like have a reality here. It's not like you get cast in. The next Marvel movie, and then you're set for life. You do have to keep that realistic ground and you're like, it's good to have work somewhere. 

David McCulloch: Yeah, I know full well that if I was very, very, very fortunate enough to get the next Marvel movie, I'm not going to be the lead. Not yet, but it will be. And, you know, I've had it where I've gone off and had quite good jobs and stuff, but I know it's coming to an end. There's nothing lined up next, so it is good to keep those side hustles in your back pocket, you know, just be open and honest with your employer and that's that. And so hopefully that they then let you back when you're done. Because there is no guarantee unless you're an actor of a certain level of, I guess fame, or if you've somehow, well, even that, as I say, if you've locked yourself into a TV series, even that is not guaranteed to get cancelled like that. It's a fantasy job. This is a fantasy job, so it is all about being. Realistic. So like it can look like a fantasy thing being an actor and some some extent is a little bit, so it's good to be keep yourself grounded. Keep things realistic. But also you've gotta push yourself. So I am on spotlight every day looking for work, applying for things there are certain. Canto casting websites, I am going on every day says casting close. But if I refresh it maybe it will come up and just. Apply for anything and everything, even if you don't think you'll be great at it, or if you think this isn't really for me, just go for it. I applied for something on spotlight. It was for a puppeteering gig. I have no experience being a puppeteer, didn't mention puppeteering on my application and I got an audition. I went in and the guy said do you have any experience with this type of puppet? And I was like, no, not this kind. But I didn't say the rest, which was not this kind, or any really.

Emily Slade: You got yourself in the door, got seen by people that might remember you, or maybe for future, and you had a a practice audition.

David McCulloch: I did, yeah. But that's another thing. Like these people in an audition room, they will see. God knows how many people a day and they're running late and everything emergent. One. Who is it now or could have been all day? I'm tired. You've got to make if you get into the audition room, make that time yours. And if they kept you waiting for over an hour and they say sorry, running late, it's absolutely fine. Don't worry about it. It's all good because you've got to give a good impression and auditioning and in the industry being in the industry. General like in any aspect whether. It's auditioning, rehearsing, acting, or just hanging out. It's not just about being a talented actor. It's about being a hard working actor. It's all about being someone that people would like to go and have a pint with. Being nice is so important. 

Emily Slade: Being nice is so important. 

David McCulloch: Yeah, just try and get yourself out there. Social media is awful at the moment, but try and network on that as much as you can. Another good bit of advice I'd say for getting to know more about the industry. And there's some actors look down it a little bit, but I'm like, no, it's great. Is applying for extras or supporting artist agencies because for that all you do is just you don't need to worry about professional headshots. There's need to know what you look like. You just need to send your measurements. A picture of yourself. And yeah, there are stories of I've done a few extras gigs and it's a it's money for old bro and B you get to see like big giant film sets. So you kind of get more of an understanding of how that side of acting works because I've only really done like. Short films or small scale indie film said see a big huge. $1,000,000 production is like wow, this is incredible. It's amazing. And you, you do get a chance to act a little bit in them. I did one recently where I wouldn't say anything. I was having to react to a person and it's like I was quite interesting doing it this way and learning about the kind of what technical aspect, putting on a big production. And you. Said I'd like to get paid as well, but getting a sandwiches are the best. If you've listened to me ramble all this time and you still want to be an actor. Go for it. If anything I said is an age you go, it's not for me. If there's ever any. I mean, I I'm my worst critic and I always doubting myself. But I always remember that. Like, well, the alternatives to go back to full time in the public sector, which. Was. OK, I sure people love it there, but I'm not built that way. I'm not built to be sat behind a computer all the time. I need to be on my feet until I fall on stage. 

Emily Slade: Yeah, it's hard. But it's not impossible. 

David McCulloch: No, it's not. And it feels impossible, especially if you don't go strong in school. 

Emily Slade: And it looks impossible when all you're reading is like the children of actors are getting all the roles, but there's so many projects out there across so many mediums that require actors. 

David McCulloch: Yeah, absolutely. And there. There's there is more out there than you think, and there's I'm very much just a start believing that there's more to acting and just what's in London because it seems like London's the cultural hard that thing and it's all here and it is because you've got all the, like, small scale pub fillets and stuff like that. You don't have much of that outside, but just. Look around and you'll find there are more local and regional companies that we're probably very grateful for. Local regional actors. You have to pay for travel to get all way down to London, but yeah, you need. A backbone a lot of courage and are just a bit of insanity for a bit if you don't go for it, you'll think, what if? And that's I was out of crossroads in my life where I was like. I have a choice to choose doing a play. I really want to do. I don't know what happened afterwards or I stick with my job and I'm comfortable and I'll spend the rest of my life going. I really wish I could have done that play, so even if many years down the line I eventually go, you know. But I'm done. At least I would have done it and I'll be happy with that.

Emily Slade: Amazing. Thank you so. So much your time.

David McCulloch: You're very welcome. 

Emily Slade: Thanks again to David for their time For more information on becoming an actor, head to prospects.ac.uk for a full length video version of this episode, check out our YouTube channel @futureyoupod. If you enjoyed the episode, feel free to leave us a review on Apple or Spotify. Thank you as always, for listening and good luck on your journey to future you. 

Notes on transcript

This transcript was produced using a combination of automated software and human transcribers and may contain errors. The audio version is definitive and should be checked before quoting.

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